Summary for those that don't want to read the entire message: I am concerned with the communications and lack of damage control being done by the GoT about M33/M34. I am worried that M33 will be a warzone. I think that scaling back Minicon is a good idea but the proposals so far have all had an underlying theme of 'they have taken over OUR Minicon' and that the people that enjoy the Minicons of the last five years or so are the 'them'.
I feel that I would be unwelcome at M34, and that I would not enjoy the convention. I am operating under the assumption that I am the type of person you want to have at M34, and that you would like to know how the proposal makes me feel otherwise, if that is not accurate then this response is irrelevant. I will try to be specific as to where I get these feelings from my response, if it is not clear let me know and I will do a word by word but wanted to keep my response shorter then the proposal.
COMMUNICATIONS:
Minicon has been one of my favorite conventions for the last five years. Through half started-never sent responses, misunderstandings, and grapevine politics I have gotten upset, felt ignored, and wondered why I am putting so much energy into discussing a convention I'm not going to go to. I have reopened this can named Minicon and for the first time got an answer to my concerns from Choyotte. I am still unsure if I will goto M33 because I don't like putting myself into the position of watching my friends fight with each other. But I do feel a little more 'heard' about M34 so I am writing this response to the revised proposal. My first question is why did it take 4 months and more messages from me to get a decent response?
Maybe it would be a good idea to have an auto responder to anyone that sends in a response to the posted proposal stating that their input is important and that one or more of the GoT will respond to them in X days. People that don't get replies to their responses and are not on or aware of M-L are not seeing the discussion and are feeling ignored and alienated. Especially since the proposal says that "People who have contacted the concom must get feedback so they know they have been heard". Also once someone has expressed interest you should keep them updated on new revision releases, I did not know about the October revision until December. Your appendix clarification should have gone out to everyone that had commented on the first proposal with a "We have taken all the comments we have gotten and made a new revision, we are sorry that we could not respond to everyone individually. If you feel that your concerns were not addressed in this new revision PLEASE let us know, you input is important to us."
GoT should be doing much more education with the people they know and at conventions they go to, they should be recruiting allies in fandom that can help get the word out. For example Rev. Choyotee is the person that finally addressed my concerns, but the people (I'd estimate that number at 20 or so) that come to me for answers, because they know I am friends with some of the GoT, are probably just getting my frustration and not any useful information. The grapevine can be your friend if used wisely, or it can spread the frustration and confusion that people are feeling.
I understand the concerns with Pre33 PR but I also see some discontent going on, and various people deciding not to go to 33 because of the perceived politics that might ensue at 33. Maybe you at least want to put a "Some of you may have heard about changes going on at M34 and after, these will not affect M33 and we will reopen discussions of M34 at the end of M33" If you want more information see our web page. Don't go into details but relieve the fears of the people thinking about not going to 33. I doubt that sticking your heads in the sand will prevent any confrontations at 33, I think that if you are going to try to hide info from any group before 33 they will get ahold of the info. The phrase "risk of people deliberately causing trouble" sure sounds like you are also expecting 'trouble' at 33 and does not make it sound like a good place to be.
A web page with various pointers to it in newsgroup postings and private email's that addresses concerns, maybe even with personal statements of people willing to be public about it, so that this discussion is more available. As M34 takes shape maybe have a listing of the membership, the dealers and the panels. Publicize this web page more then it has been.
Problems with Minicon currently
Remember that some people don't see problems with the current Minicon, reading the proposal might be their first introduction to these problems. Bringing up the convention book (p5) and other 'user level problems' shows some of the cracks that non-con-com can see. You might want to point out that other cracks are causing the breaking of Minicon and might not be visible to people not on the con com. Not doing so starts to define 'us' as the people that see a problem with the current Minicon and 'them' as the people that enjoy the con in its current state.
I agree that many/most of these problems can be quickly solved with 'continuity, documentation, and monitoring'(p6). All of the restructuring ideas are good ones and that is a good place to focus your proposal.
Focus
You need to be aware of other connotations of phrases that you use. There have been various debates in fandom that 'only hard SF' is fannish, or that 'kids read fantasy'. You might want to change 'focus on written science fiction' to specifically list science fiction and fantasy to avoid fallout from other debates.
Another hot spot. 'alternative cultures festival' Please either define this phrase or GET RID OF IT. Alternative is a word that is often used to describe gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender, polyamory, BDSM, Tattooed folks ... these are subcultures in fandom that having been told 'get out' in the world beyond fandom are probably fairly sensitive to being labeled 'them'. Make sure you clarify that you might be ruling out some activities (panel on how multiple adult relationships differ between Heinlein and reality) but that people that are polyamours are welcome to be at the convention, and not a "we don't want those faggots here". I've been told the actual desire is to cut down on the number of "Fringe" fans, who come for *only* the Masquerade, or the Rave, etc, people who would not ordinarily attend a convention, but just come to watch the weird people, or to get drunk. But some people that go to other conventions and do go the extra distance to Minicon because of these added items might feel they are being told they aren't welcome.
The reason that I enjoy the mulit-focus aspect of Minicon (and worldcon) is that it draws all my friends to one location so I can see them all at once. There are people that I hang out with at Minicon that I don't go to a single panel/event with since we have such different interests but we spend time in consuite or at meals together. This draws me to Minicon even though it is a considerable distance and expense for me. If Minicon becomes a smaller convention that does not draw all these people then I will probably go to different cons that are closer (say one in Iowa and one in Madison) to see these people.
Dealers - Rare (expensive) book dealers are not a draw to me, I am not even keeping up on the new books that I buy, the dealers that I spend money on are used books (John Jamison), new books (Glen Cooke), artistic (Van Tilburgs, Santara, Erin McKee, Felix), Jewlery, Gaming (I don't have a good local gaming store) and such. It might be a good idea to list specific dealers in the PR and on the web pages as they get determined.
Programming - I'm getting a "we will be turning programming into the high-brow Fourth Street track" While I have heard that many people enjoy Fourth Street I never felt that it was somewhere I would want to go to or that I would feel welcome at, that it was "for the pros, and not the annoying fans" . I have no interest in a "Similarities of expository structure' type of panel I couldn't even tell you what that meant. I would much rather discuss the characters and how they reacted, I enjoy watching people deal with new and alternative situations that I find so much of in SF&F. It should be made clearer that large costly events (Masquerade) are being cut because of logistics and budget, not because they are 'not worthy' or 'not fannish'. I do want to know if music/DarkStar will still be part of Minicon since I enjoy them a lot (one of the added draws for me). But if you are drawing lines because of SF content I would assume that acts like Lojo and Wild Mountain Thyme will be cut. I have no problem with you wanting to scale back, even if you just arbitrarily cut something's and not others, but drop the 'blame' the 'them' and the 'fannish' Make sure that people know that Minicon NOW is a type of fandom but that M34 will be only a 'subset' of that that will be focused on what the GoT see as their favorite parts since something needs to be cut. Not that the things being cut are 'wrong' or 'bad' or 'not fannish' but that that is just where the cuts are being drawn.
Hospitality - Thank you for addressing the smoking issue early on, and the fact that the Raddison is not the assumed hotel. I have been to "author, bookseller and publisher parties" at conventions and worldcons and had the same 'pros only' feel there: that if I am not well read and wanting to ONLY discuss books and literature then I am not welcome. I like to socialize at conventions, I use the fact that we have the same interests and reading background as a foundation but rarely discuss the 'how x VS y treat technology' kinds of subjects. What about parties for groups of fandom (Trolls guild, Gay Fandom), other conventions, and worldcon bids? Will they be in other places or will they not be allowed?
Us VS Them
There is an underlying thread of Us VS Them that runs through the proposal: that the people that are 'cloistered'(p2) away, have 'stopped coming to Minicon'(p5), and 'feel unsafe and unwelcome at our hometown convention'(p6) are the 'us' that are wanted at M34. The 'where have all the fan's gone(p6) question implies they are not at Minicon, and conversely that the people that have been out enjoying Minicon of the last five years are not fans, and are the 'them' that are not wanted.
Listing people (Jeanne Gomoll, Dan Goodman, Spike Parsons) and references (karass, granfalloon) that I have not met or not come across in my time in fandom imply that I am not part of the 'us'. Maybe my fandom ("them") is very different then your ("us") fandom. I'm sure that I have names and references that I consider fannish that aren't part of Mpls vocabulary. I do like the section by Ben Yalow especially the line about 'anyone who is interested...will be welcome' this does some to relieve the prior us VS them feelings maybe this should be earlier on before any 'alternative' attacks.
The line about "if it makes you feel you wouldn't be good enough" is a keeper - MOVE THIS MUCH further up. and stress this much more - this is the line that gives me the most hope, and makes me think that maybe I've gotten the wrong impression. Also the "purpose is not to drive away". Maybe you want to try harder to get to know 'them' and maybe you will realize that we are not all evil monsters responsible for the demise of your Minicon.
'(p3)seed money' I do like the offer to possibly provide seed money to people wanting to start a new convention, but be careful not to be condescending about this.
SEMP analogy - 'to many unwelcome people' (them) My understanding of SEMP is that if you are in the right circles you will hear about it and good enough you will be invited (until last year I though it was invitation only audience also) therefore if I am not specifically invited to M34 am I not welcome there? or only those folks we know and like can play, those that are 'in the know' can listen, everyone else should go away.
Mpls73 Suite - fannish haven (us), it's not just the neos that feel that it is a private party and they are unwelcome. I know some people in there and feel that way - it is the elitist room so they can get away from the masses (me) There are many GoT people that I hang out with at other conventions but do not spend any time with at Minicon. I've always gotten the impression they were to busy or wanted to spend time with their other friends that travel up to Minicon that they don't get a chance to see, but over time I have grown to feel that I am not good enough to play in their turf but will 'make do' with me if there is not anyone better to hang with. The only place/time I feel 'welcome' by the GoT at Minicon is being at the audience of the SEMP Sunday night once the convention is 'over'. This feeling is the same that I get from reading the proposal. Maybe it is just different ways of explaining things, and maybe I am an isolated case, but I'm hearing grapevine that other people are feeling just as excluded.
Mentioning (p7) that it is harder to strike up an interesting conversation at Minicon does not correspond to my reality of Minicon of the last 5 years. I have met new people every year, in the con suite, in the lobby and in the bar. I find it an advantage that there are more people present and therefore more chances of finding someone that I have stuff in common with.
Minn-StF
The resolution implies that who you want at M34 are people that are members of Minn-Stf or are potential members, if someone has been at a few Minicons and hasn't gotten any impression on MStF and their first impression is the politicking and confusion they see surrounding M34 then once again they feel like a 'them'. If the main goal is new members then you should draw your focus locally and maybe even discourage out of town attendees, becoming a smaller richer local convention.
I do agree that changes need to be done and on the 'what we will do' level the proposal sounds really good, but you do need to be very careful that the very people you want at M34 won't feel they are part of the problem and not welcome.
Personal Statements
Lydia: 'no money and nowhere to crash' So you are saying that you want ghosts at the convention, people that show up, don't register, don't get a hotel room? I call those 'ghosts' and on conventions I have worked at we try to discourage them. You 'stopped feeling safe in consuite' so are people that do feel safe there either disillusioned or the people that make you feel unsafe?
Susan: Sorry that your family reunion has been crashed by all of us 'alternative lifestyles' people who don't know who sawed Courtney's boat. I have my own feeling of family reunion at Minicon with the folks that I know and hang out with. Your statement seems to imply that the people feeling like the family reunion is being crashed, or have left cause they didn't find it are the ones that are welcome, and the rest of us are 'them'.
DDB: You state that everyone you ask attends Minicon in defensive mode, they stay away from the zoo, this implies that the people 'out there' are "them" that are causing the problems. I've never been in the 'closed room Minicon' except the SEMP Sunday night. "The real fun at Minicon is no longer out in the open" says to me that if I enjoy the out in the open of the last few Minicons then M34 will be something very different, and not what I enjoy of Minicon.
Karen: I don't know your references, I'm not part of your 'corners of civility' (implying that the rest of the con is not civil) I'm sorry that my friends and I seem to have no interest in fandom to you, maybe it is a different type of fandom. I'm sorry that you feel a need to avoid us. Refocusing Minicon to what you want is fine, but what I'm hearing is an attack that I have ruined your convention for you, I apologize and will stay clear of your new revised Minicon.
Geri: Thanks for saying that there have been good Minicons in the last 8-10 years, I have been feeling that they are 'bad and wrong' and the people going are the 'problem' I'm sorry that you find the consuite a place to avoid - I probably spend more time in consuite at Minicon then at most other conventions. Your statement seems to imply that since I can be found there then I am not one of your 'trufans'. I meet new people every year at Minicon, some that have founded friendships that span they years and exist outside Minicon. I'm sorry that you can't find that. I do agree that not passing on things and tracking info can be a problem, and most of the parts about changes are things that need to be done but there is also an underlying theme of 'who is welcome' and that does not seem to be me.
Beth: I've heard the 'gathering of the tribes' reference to Minicon and that is one of the reasons that I go. Many friends of mine that have general convention interested but specialize in one section all find enough of their interest to spend the money to travel to Minicon, which advantage to me is that I get to see everyone in one trip. I'm sorry that you don't like those of us that in addition to SF fandom also identify as pagan, bdsm, or whatever. I would think that what you mean is the people that 'just' like say bdsm and are 'only' there for the play parties, but I know many folks that go to the bdsm parties at Minicon that I also see at other panels and in con suite at Minicon, that also go to the masquerade, the signings, the art show and such. Maybe there are the 'just' people out there but I don't run into them. I'm sorry that you are disappointed in the Minicon that I have grown to love in the last seven years.
Steven: I'm sorry that you no longer see the faerie in Minicon, I see it all over, at the SEMP, in the con suite, at the dance and rave, in the lobby, in the long conversations in the stairwells. It is one of the things that draws me to Minicon. I watch the televised version of the masquerade since it is to crowded to get into, for me a sign that it has become very popular (But then I enjoy masquerades). So, will Music still be part of M34? That doesn't seem clear except in your statement - I wonder how that is part of SF where a masquerade of costumes based on characters from books in the field are not. Be sure to be clear where you are drawing the lines.
Fred: 'Hit the Neofan with a stick' I don't think anyone would consider me a neofan but I sure feel like I've been hit by a big stick with regards to M34 and it is not the friendly one that I often use to flirt with. "we is putting on Minicon for they" again implies that 'they' are the people that have been enjoying Minicon for the last few years. It just seems strange that at other conventions our worlds coincide but at Minicon they don't. I'm sorry that none of your descriptors seem to describe your Minicon experience anymore, they do describe my Minicon experience. "Secret Master turned and ran away without uttering a word" This feels much like the response that I have gotten. So I am trying once again to hit the secret master with a stick (hopefully a friendly one) so he can see how things are being read and interpreted by at least this fan.
>Where is the line of fannish community being drawn?
Choyotte says: The line is being drawn here. "This is what we will be having at the convention (list of panels, art show, hucksters, con suite, music, parties, etc.). If you think that you would enjoy these things at a convention, then we are for you. If you don't have any interest in these things, then can we suggest another convention for you? If you aren't certain, come and give us a try. If you enjoyed yourself, come back again next year, and if you didn't, thanks for giving us a try.
Samantha Star Straf
Written Jan 12, 1998
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